dontcarebear

Good luck and thank you for you help!

Almost no one out there is supporting Hamas, and if you unilaterally support Israel, you are anti-Palestinian.

You are willfully ignoring my last comment to give your strawman some hay.

The fact that you think fighting Hamas includes indiscriminately bombing civilians shows you are in support of the ongoing genocide of an ethnic

minority Strawman, I never said that the IDF should or is bombing indiscriminately. That is YOUR belief and you’re forcing it upon my words.

And to call yourself a minority to try to gain sympathy is pathetic at best.

Yet another misunderstanding. I didn’t say that to garner sympathy. I said that to make the point that this situation is just a classical case of the Majority’s tyranny. Granted, @risk suffered it worse, but the situation is just two sides of the same coin except I hang around in Lemmy and he hangs around in News websites.

The KKK is also a minority, so by your logic, we should all try to sympathize with their plight. Oh look, it’s your favorite rhetorical instrument. A strawman.

Well, enforcing that will send Israel into a political turmoil since it was on the verge of a civil war before this war started. Also, interesting to note that 2008 was one of those rare times when Benjamin Netanyahu wasn’t at power, but that doesn’t help the situation right now.

I also agree that you can’t remove Hamas with a sledgehammer. You can’t kill ideology with bullets. Israel isn’t claiming to be doing that right now. They declared they’re doing 2 things:

1. Returning the kidnapped Israelis home.
2. Disabling Hamas’ ability to strike.

Can’t ignore the last fact here though, that Benjamin Netanyahu wants a military regime once the war is over. You’d have to insane to support that.

Definitely. Those are facts. What is your point?

Who says I don’t? Israel should definitely stop the settlements, push to join the Palestinians into the abrahamic accords, do what they can to bring actual peace instead of placating their religious fanatics for an easy vote.

I said I support Israel. In which I meant that I support Israel’s fight against Hamas. Yes, that entails hurting civilians. Yes, that is a sad state of affairs.

I don’t think criticizing Israel is wrong here, nor do I wish for more civilian bloodshed. I do, however, see the end of the war with Hamas no longer being able to actively threat Israel a legitimate goal.

Why does that mean I’m a Nazi?

I agree with your statement and would retract the use of the word “persecuted”, as it is a matter of severity.

The inflicting of suffering, harassment, imprisonment, internment, fear or pain are all factors that may establish persecution, but not all suffering will necessarily establish persecution. The threshold of severity has been a source of much debate. Source: Wikipedia

Being ostracized in a Lemmy debate clearly isn’t persecution. It is a lack of pluralism or tolerance. Something you can criticize, but definitely isn’t something anyone owes anyone else here. It’s more of a matter of civility.

I agree with you on most of what you said here. Things are fucked. Better solutions should be sought, especially diplomatic ones - if possible. Until such a solution presents itself, stopping Israel sounds like a bad idea.

Yes Hamas is a terror organization, no, that does not allow you to behave like a terror organization when fighting them.

I agree.

If you have read the article this is not about innocents which where at the wrong place a the wrong time. This article is about deliberate destruction of civilian buildings without giving any justification besides ‘There are some things that we see that you don’t see.’ in some cases evacuation was allowed, in some cases no time for evacuation was given. There is in my eyes no justification for this.

I respect your sentiment that you can’t justify killing innocents no matter the cause. I also respectfully disagree, and I accept “There are somethings that we see that you don’t” as tactical reasoning. I don’t do this with a happy heart, or a sense of conviction. It is a sad to thing to recognize.

You don’t let your enemy know how you know where to hit, because that would expose your intelligence - be it collaborators, equipment or units - to your enemy.

I do agree though, that it leaves you with doubt that the IDF isn’t just murdering people. However I don’t think they’d go to such trouble to sometimes notify and sometimes not. It doesn’t make sense.

Yesterday a group of refugees ran across the corridor from the north to the south holding white flags. The Palestinians here are suffering, and require humanitarian aid, but they were let through. They weren’t executed or attacked. Source is from the guardian, which is center-left in bias.

I never said that Israel should stand idle. So don’t push that opinion on me.

I apologize for putting words in your mouth or assuming your opinion for you. I was wrong here to a fault.

What could be done? Attack military targets only, give civilians time to evacuate. (Yes a civilian home becomes a military target if it is used as weapons stash/factory, but there was no indication at all in the cases listed in the article),

Hamas doesn’t follow the Geneva Convention. It’s fighters don’t dress as a military, they dress in civilian clothing. Maybe not as a rule, but there’s definitely footage that Hamas itself released with their fighters wearing Jeans and T Shirts.

Regarding allowing civilians to evacuate - This is again the issue of tactical reasoning from before.

support the more moderate Fatah in regaining control. Support new democratic elections.

I’ll add - remove the Likud and Netanyahu from power, add the Palestinians into the Abraham accords. All worthy things to do AFTER the war, and should be done. No doubt.

Destroying peoples homes and basic utilities will only ensure that hate on Israel grows and support for Hamas remains steady.

I whole-heatedly agree with you on this one. Both sides are losing right now. I think this war will mean that Fatah will disappear and the west bank will become Hamas too. And then the situation is twice as fucked.

To say that it is wrong that @Risk can’t express himself freely on a news article? I’m pretending to care for his opinion? Why? How am I a fraud?

No need to get personal. I was empathizing with a person who is getting harassed for his opinions. Kinda like what you’re doing right now.

I would if I could see another solution to the problem of the war right now.

Israel carries a lot of blame here with it’s right winged rule over a decade. No doubt.

But how can you stop Hamas now? I’m truly asking. This isn’t a rhetoric question.

Did you mean unbiased?

Well, that would mean a whole lot of work than just making sure people are civil. That would mean fact checking, confirming and banning accordingly.

That is a LOT of work… Can’t fault the mods for that.

As long as it is civil, it should be what it is. At least that’s my opinion.

I do agree that any cycle of violence further radicalizes the Palestinians. It also marginalized the Israeli left since Yitzhak Rabin was murdered. Both sides keep pushing, like a pendulum, ever since the negotiations with Yasser Arafat failed due to the right of return.

Are the Israelis solely to blame for this? Maybe. Does it provide a solution for the here and now? No.

That’s a false dichotomy, and one alternative approach was already provided in the comment you originally replied to.

The original comment says integration, that is a one state solution for the two people. That means that the right of return takes place. If that happens, Israel is no longer a Jewish state.

How can you integrate with a political movement that just murdered and kidnapped people your people? Who vowed to destroy your nation in very colorful ways? How do you solve the here and now?

I agree that Israel shares plenty of blame, primarily the government and the right wing. Ok. How does that neutralize the threat of Hamas now? How does that stop the rockets? How can the IDF pull back and not get another surprise attack in three weeks?

I said only on Lemmy.

I actually empathized with the man. I think he should be allowed to express himself without being persecuted EVEN THOUGH I THINK HIS OPINION IS WRONG.

It came out wrong because of my talk of minority.

Never said it was unswerving, but I am hated for my opinion here. It is expected. How dare I justify murder, right?

Hamas is a terror organization. Hamas confirmed it will repeat it’s actions over and over until every jew is dead or driven from Israel. Hamas is still firing rockets at Israel and fighting the IDF. Hamas cynically uses the Geneva convention to shield itself as it commits war crimes.

It is true that the actions of the military kill innocents. I think it would’ve happened even without Hamas using them as human shields.

But should Israel simply stand idle as it’s citizens are slaughtered and kidnapped? If so, then why?

I did correct myself in that I only share his feelings as being persecuted. I clearly don’t know who is a minority in this debate and it was wrong to assume so.

I corrected myself. You are not a minority in the world, as I don’t know the numbers and there are clearly a lot of sympathizers of the Palestinian cause in England, Spain, France and the US. I don’t even know what is going on in the rest of the world.

I can only empathize with the writer’s original emotion of feeling like a persecuted minority.

EDIT I retract my use of the word “Persecuted”. At best, this is lack of tolerance.

I feel the same way here (Lemmy) because I support Israel. Funny, how being a minority works.

EDIT: to be fair, I don’t have the numbers to claim who is a minority or not.

The epic game store feels like a rushed, impulse move by some boomer manager.